Go Bottomwhat if the fuel is already gelled
 | kcaver
Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5 kentucky 
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2010-01-13 168013
If the fuel is already gelled, will adding a fuel addivtive help? Will have to let it warm up first and then add the additive to prevent it from happing again?
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 | Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada 
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2010-01-13 168016
No, there are special additives, the first that comes to mind is "PowerService 911" (bright red bottle) that will quickly melt right through the gelled fuel.
Heat will of course do the trick too, but as soon as it cools down the problem will come right back.
Best of luck. ....
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| kcaver
Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5 kentucky
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2010-01-13 168017
ok, that is what I needed to know, I will get the powerservice 911. I saw some people talking about this and could purchase it at walmart?
thanks for your help
Suzanne ....
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 | greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky 
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2010-01-13 168019
Walmart, any farm store, auto parts store, truck stop, etc. Once you get the tractor running, I'd drain the wet fuel and replace with fresh. This time make sure to add an anti-gel additive. There are several brands, I personally use Power Service year-round. It's marketed in three formulas: Red jug = emergency anti-gel, White jug = winter (with anti-gel), Silver jug = spring/summer/fall (no anti-gel).
//greg// ....
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| kcaver
Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5 kentucky
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2010-01-13 168020
Thanks so much, I feel better about this now, I was a little worried. ....
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 | earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-01-13 168021
Simply dumping it in the tank will not "melt" or thaw the lines--you need to have flow for that. I'm pretty sure the red jug I have said remove the filter and fill it 50/50 with it and fuel then reinstall. I feel the way they worded it they are implying that only the filter is froze up and not the lines or anything else except the filter.
BTW, I tried just the filter idea on my Ram and it didn't work--the lines were still froze. The truck had to be tented with plastic and warmed with a heater for half a day. (Snow and ice from plowing the night before was packed up under the chassis which all had to melt) ....
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| hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-01-13 168025
Probably some limited profanity would be justified for starters, but I've dumped the filters and put the white jug stuff in. I didn't have any 911 handy, and it did work. This was on a Case 1070 farm tractor, then dumped the rest of the jug in the fuel tank. It kind of coughed a nd gagged the rest of the day till things cleared out. ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-01-13 168026
The few times we've had that problem it was colder than a politicians heart and not very nice weather for working outside, especially not at anything that involved cold steel against bare hands, let alone hands soaked in diesel!
The method my fleet maintenance guy used was, pour PowerService 911 into fuel tank, open water separator valve. If no fuel runs out, apply an air hose with a rag wrapped around it to the filler opening till a good amount of fuel runs out. Close water separator valve. Start engine, with WD-40 (or ether if need be) and let it run at a slightly elevated idle for a while.
Once the engine is running the pump(s) will circulate fuel via the return line back to the tank and distribute the 911 around pretty good.
Best of luck. ....
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| kcaver
Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5 kentucky
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2010-01-14 168033
Thanks everyone, I appreciate all the knowledge, what a great place!
Suzanne ....
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 | kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-01-14 168049
Murf: "it was colder than a politicians heart "
Boy that is such a good term. Never had heard it. Do you think this antigell for diesel fuel would work with them?
Find the instrustions you give makes sense for them also.
You know some place would kick me off for that. Long Live TP. ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-01-14 168051
Kenny, you're right, and I did get kicked off another site for just such a comment! But we're such a nice bunch of people over here that wouldn't happen. ;)
I'm not sure that stuff would work on politicians, they don't run on diesel, it's gas I'm sure, a form of natural gas if you know what I mean.
BTW, the device you pull behind the tractor to spread the "all natural fertilizer" on the fields is known almost exclusively around here as a 'politician'.
It's full of..........err, ummm, well, 'stuff', all it does is spread that same 'stuff' around, and really only works about 3 days a year.
I couldn't think of a more appropriate name for it.
Best of luck.
....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-01-15 168058
Murf, we may need to start a seperate thread on politicans.
But wondering about the dieselfueld being gelled. It really does not get cold enough her normally for this to be any issue. But does the same treatment work for fuel that has gelled due to age? A couple of years back my brother poured some diesel into a tractor that was gelled due to age had to be I guess and it was a bear or rather unbearable. He tried some adding something suggested but a dealership but if it helped it was very little. ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-01-15 168063
No Kenny, when fuel 'gels' what is really happening is two-fold.
First of all, the paraffins (wax) and asphaltines (yup, what asphalt is made from) that naturally exist in the fuel start to solidify. This usually isn't a problem when they are liquids, but as solids they start to build up on the fuel filter plugging it solid.
The second, and less complicated problem is simply, ice! Diesel is a liquid that is "hydroscopic", that means it will absorb, and hold in solution, water. Of course once the temperature drops to 32° F. you know what happens there. Those crystals also clog the filters.
So, yes, eventually the 'gel' will dissolve on it's own once the temperature rises a ways above the freezing point. The problem is though, you would then have a big blob of wax, asphalt and water trapped in the filter. Not a good situation.
Even in your location, relatively protected from cold temps, the last little while being the exception, it would still be prudent to run additives such as the white bottle of PowerService or something like it during the fall to spring period. The problem where you are is that they don't worry so much about running "winter blend" diesel, a sudden cold snap can then be a real PITA.
Best of luck. ....
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 | auerbach
Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 2168 West of Toronto
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2010-01-15 168065
Anybody know the temp at which summer grade and winter grade diesel starts to gel? It must be way below freezing because I never had a problem in our winters for decades, and wasn't then aware of anti-gelling additives. ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-01-16 168088
The fuel my brother poured in his tractor had been in a 5 gallon can for a couple of years or so his guess. Which would have been two winters cycles and normally our lows don't drop below 20, hey to me 40 is cold.
Is it possible it was not the same type of gelling being discussed here but something else. It was shirt sleeve weather when he added the fuel for I remember working on draining it well. ....
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| greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2010-01-16 168090
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That was enough to teach me to mark fuel my containers as fuel that was purchased in the summer, or as winter fuel that "should" have been treated before sale. Even then I don't trust the local stations to properly treat the winter fuel - so I still add my own Power Service just to be sure. Since then, I've started tractors down to -7F without difficulty.
//greg// ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-01-18 168121
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There is no magic number. It all depends on the quality of the fuel. The higher the levels of paraffin, asphaltines and water the lower the temperature at which you run into problems. Paraffin is the big problem, as you know from other sources of paraffin wax such as candles, it solidifies at a pretty warm temperature.
Starting fairly early in the fall (usually around Labour Day up here) the oil distributors start shipping "winter blend" fuel, unless you just happened to be running some fuel bought in the early summer you likely wouldn't know the difference. Also, most diesel additives and even the stuff sold as "fuel conditioner" has enough anti-gel properties to keep you from running into problems with summer blend fuel.
Best of luck. ....
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 | Mitchb
Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 8 Fairbanks, Alaska
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2010-01-25 168213
The pour point blend of diesel fuel varies by state and winter months. In Alaska where I live it's -25 C in October and moves down to -49 C in December. I have started and used my tractor down to -25 F, but I avoid that every chance I get. I use Power Service summer and winter - works for me. The chart in this link is a little dated but it should be pretty close. ....
Link: Diesel pour point
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