Go BottomEngine removal on a Kioti LB series
 | Scott E
Join Date: Posts: 1 
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2003-04-09 52835
How big of a job is it to pull the 3 cylinder dieselout of a Kioti for internal engine repair,has excessive crankcase pressure,now wont start,was knocking,pushing oil out of the crankcase vent,puffs real hard out the oil fill hole while cranking.Or should I just short block it?
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| Anon
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2003-04-12 53031
Is this the one that had been run on gasoline? Call a Kioti dealer and get a shop manual and a parts manual. It will be worth the money. It will make it alot easier buying parts too. ....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley 
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2003-04-13 53055
Most tractors have to be split to remove the engine. Splitting is feasible but it does take blocks, hoists, TX jacks etc. An over head hoist would be handy. Manuals would be essential.
Depending on what's wrong an in tractor overhaul might be possible. I've done it on light-trucks. The basic idea is that the head, oil pan and timing-gear covers are removed. Piston rods are unbolted from the crank and removed through the top. To get the piston out, it may take a reamer to remove a ridge at the top of the piston travel. Loosening the main bearing bolts usually allows enough clearance to remove and replace bearing inserts and main seals (the seals are a problem).
With this sort of overhaul, most engine tolerances can be checked and parts replaced as needed. The head can be done completely. Of course, the cylinders can't be bored or the crank turned, but at least you know if they really need it. Of course the only time I've done this is when I didn't have access to an engine hoist, TX jack etc. Just removing an engine is easier.
Despite the engine removal description, I think it's important to diagnosis exactly what's wrong before tearing into it. From the description, It doesn't quite sound what sound like a high hour engine that needs some machining. It also doesn't quite sound like major damage such as a cracked block. I'd at least do a compression test.
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| Scott E.
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2003-04-13 53067
No,this one hasnt been run on gas,Im not sure what has haooened internally,but it started knockin and got louder as the guy used it,now it wint even start,somebody removed the head and put a headgasket on it,but thats not the problem,its much deeper than a head concern.Thanks for any and all info guys,much appreciated. ....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-04-14 53098
Sounds like it's a friend's tractor. The problem may well turn into a nightmare and such things can sure test a friendship. It also sounds like guessing what the problem was and replacing the head gasket may have resulted in running a damaged engine longer, which may not have done it any favours.
The overall description sound like at least two problems, which I guess could have a common cause. However, at this stage trying to guess the specific problems may not be particularly worthwhile. It sounds like the engine should come out so it can be gone through properly.
Doing anything at this level really requires manuals and getting them should be a first step. Splitting a tractor (which I haven't done) isn't too big a deal and a manual's procedures should be followed. It isn't too hard to guess how to do it though. The basic idea is that eveything that connects the two halves together are disconnected, the case bolts (or buckle-up bolts) are removed and the two halves pulled away from each other. In the case of a TX/engine split, ordinarily the TX is blocked and the engine rear is supported with a rolling jack such as a TX jack. 4wd tractors with pivoting front axles have to have the engine blocked against the rails or it may fall over.
It's a good idea to use hydraulic jacks to support each end, because it can take some adjusting to get all the binds released so the tractor will pull apart easily. Still, there are things called 'splitting malls' that are used. Once the tractor is split, then the engine can be removed. This may be starting to sound like something you'd be reluctant to tackle and I'd probably agree.
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 | Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-04-14 53122
The local independant farm shop near my farm has a nifty device for splitting tractors, it makes clutch replacement a snap, OK a couple of snaps. It is a set of rails, kind of like a small peice of railway track. There is a fixed vertical post at both ends, and a pair of rolling 'jacks' on dolly wheels in between. They position the jacks together on either side of the split and fasten them to the tractor. The front end of the tractor is fastened to one of the posts and the rear half is pulled by a chain come-a-long between the other post and the drawbar. after unbolting the bellhousing and the various linkages, etc., the entire rear half of the tractor just rolls back away from the front half. Assembly is almost as easy since the track and supports keep everything in (almost) perfect alignment.
I'm sure a similar setup could be rigged on a temporary basis to facilitate an engine job, but I sure wouldn't want to try splitting a tractor except as an absolute last option.
Best of luck. ....
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 | Peters
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2003-04-14 53126
I am sorry that few of our members have had any experience with the Kioti rebuilds. They have not been in the country all that long, it may attest to the toughness of the tractor that few have tackled it.
In a lot of the older tractors you could remove the pistons without dismantling the tractor, just remove the oil pan and drop them out.
It might be useful to pull the pistons and inspect the cylinders and bearings before dismantling the entire tractor. If the problem can be repaired with rod bearings and rings then this may be the way to go. At least you would have a better understanding of the problem.
I won't comment again about separating the tractor it is not that difficult, but it is often easier to work on in the tractor due to the high engine heighth.
Peters ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-04-15 53173
I just spoke to a neighbour who is a trucker/beef farmer, he bought an old Massey-Ferguson at an auction last year for buttons because the motor was shot, someone had pulled the drain plug to do an oil change but left the machine, it was inadvertantly started and used without oil.
He figured the local heavy truck repair shop does inframe engine rebuilds all the time on trucks, why not a tractor? They apparently said they would do it if he got them the shop manual and they could do it as a 'time and material' job, not flat-rate. He agreed and they did rings, all the bearings and seals.
They apparently did a first class job, and for what he considered to be not much money. He estimates he ended up with a decent tractor for about a third of what it would have cost to buy normally. ....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-04-16 53210
That sounds like a good outcome. The only risk I can see to trying it is if a shop was prepared to do an in-tractor over-haul but wasn't prepared to do a split. A mechanic may get inside the engine and said 'Oops the engine has to come out' then the tractor's a basket case unless the mechanics is paid to put it back together again. Happened sometimes in the motorcycle trade. Somebody' would try a do-it-yourself and then show up at the shop with a frame and a basket of parts. Most mechanics try to hide until such jobs are dealt.
We haven't had further description of the problem so we probably should just let it rest. I am sort of curious though. Maybe the knock isn't a bearing and the oil blowing was just too much oil, and it won't start now because the valve clearances are too tight after the head gasket job. Well, that'd be unrealistic 'no real problem' explanation. I might drain the oil through a strainer and look for coolant and maybe chunks or rings. Perhaps pull the pan too. I might check the valve clearances and pull the injectors or glow plugs. They could be replaced one at a time and the engine could be rotated to check for a cylinder that has no compression.
It might be good to figure if the engine has replaceable cylinder sleeves and if so whether replacement could be done in tractor. The splitting gadget sounds a lot better than the flock of blocks and jacks I'd have to resort to.
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