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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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ftcnlc
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5 Oviedo,Florida
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2003-12-09          70623


Hi Guys! Hubby is sitting here with me and can give you all some more detail as to our dilemma with the (what we think?) might be a stuck clutch. Here is the scenario - it won't start unless its in neutral. The in super low gear he is able to engage the transmission in either forward or reverse and he can drive around the driveway in superlow gear. While holding the clutch in - he hits the brakes and drags the blade attachment but its not enough resistance to cause the clutch to come loose.

He can take the starter off and access a view of the flywheel and he is using a large syringe with some rust removal liquid and a flexible hose to try to get some liquid between the clutchplate and the flywheel. Turing the flywheel with a screwdriver he can access approximately 8 locations that will allow the lubrication and he is about ready to reinstall the starter and drive around the driveway again!

Thanks for your help guys - stay tuned.

Nancy the farmer




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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-12-09          70626


As I said, I was not there to see and I was surprized when the guy emailed me back and told me what he did. The clutch on my old L245 was stuck as well. I bought it that way. I just adjusted to it. I found that if I start the tractor with it in gear, and never placed the trans in neutral while releasing the clutch to the out position; I could shift between gears without much problem. If I let the clutch out while in neutral; it would grind horribly. Rather than grind the gears, I would just shut the tractor down, put it back in gear and restart it. The above is what I told the guy and he came up with the idea of placing the tractor against a wall so just the tires were pushing against it and said he broke the clutch loose. The owner's manual for my old Kubota warned to use a 1" block of wood to place under the clutch pedal to prevent this from happening. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-12-09          70631


A lot of newer units have a little hook behind the clutch pedal. You push the clutch pedal all the way down then flip the hook down and it holds the pedal down for you.

I'm a little confused about the description here though. If the clutch is siezed in the engaged position, how is it that it will disengage enough to put it in one gear but not another?

Unless what is really happening is the clutch is so far out of adjustment that it spins free in anything but first or reverse.

More coffee required.

....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-12-09          70634


I'll second that Murf! I am starting my second cup of coffee and I am still scratch my head trying to picture the mechanical dynamics of how this works. ;-) ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-12-09          70677


I'm playing catch-up here. I'm not sure if the problem is that the tractor only has power in low gears (a seriously slipping clutch could do that) or if it can't be shifted into higher gears. If it can't be shifted I'm wondering if that's with the engine running, off or both; and in or out of 4wd? I think most TX's would shift when the engine was off in 2wd even with a frozen clutch. this sort of detail might help the diagnosis if it wasn't included in e-mails.

For cheap fixes of frozen clutches, I have heard of tractors that have removable clutch-housing splash-pans freed up with big screwdrivers or long cold chisels. If there's access to the clutch a little WD-40 probably wouldn't hurt either. If it's slipping there may be crud or corrosion behind the throw-out bearing.

I've also heard of them freed by chaining the axle to something immovable and taking up some slack with an 'educated jerk' (there are some risks to tractor and operator doing this sort of stuff). Both cheap solutions are done with the clutch pedal blocked but you should be sure that operation of the pedal actually releases the pressure plate. Another variation is 'jerk-towing ' by a truck. That one sounds like something I wouldn't try. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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popabear
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 15 S. E. Michigan
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2004-02-12          76734


Can you push the clutch pedal in and will it release? Do you feel spring pressure when pushing the clutch pedal and can you feel the throw out bearing contact the pressure plate fingers? It could be the input shaft is frozen in the pilot bearing in the flywheel. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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JerryG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 54 NW AR
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2004-02-14          76824


A tranny with creeper gears will engage without the clutch. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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ftcnlc
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5 Oviedo,Florida
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2004-02-15          76946


The hydralic clutch reservoir had drained out so my husband had to refill the reservoir. So now it pumps up as far as the clutch pedal is concerned, but the clutch does not seem to disengage from the flyweel face. If there is a bearing that releases in there, he doesn't feel any tension when the clutch is disengaged. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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ftcnlc
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5 Oviedo,Florida
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2004-02-15          76958


At idle speed on the low side range, he can get it to go into gear without much trouble. If he desires to get it into gear on the high side, he has to have it moving before jamming it in gear or it will kill the engine. But once in gear, it will run just fine. Plenty of power but even with the clutch engaged, under a load, it will not break loose. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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harvey
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 1550 Moravia, NY
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2004-02-16          76992


Nancy What model tractor? It sounds like one of the slave cylinders is bad and either needs rebuilding or replacing. So if you do one you should do both. Be ready for an expensive repair.

I am quite suprised that a tractor would have a system like that for the clutch. Those arangements are quite expensive on trucks and cars. ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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ftcnlc
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5 Oviedo,Florida
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2004-02-16          77066


Hi!

The tractor is a 1993 Agco-Allis 5680 4WD. We're rather surprised at your comment - all we've heard is that it needs to be broken in two and the clutch repaired. The cost quote we got was $900+. Any more thoughts?

Nancy The Farmer ....


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DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998
Posts: 2707 NorthWest NJ
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2004-02-16          77072


Nancy,

Can you please stop posting 10 messages of the same message. Looks like you have a broken keyboard as well as the tractor issue.

TractorPoint ....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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AC5ZO
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 928 Rio Rancho, NM 87144
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2004-02-17          77130


I am not familiar with this tractor, but I have worked on a number of hydraulic clutches. Hydraulic clutches are good from the standpoint of adjustments. Generally the reservoir "being drained out" is not a good sign. The fluid went somewhere. It can indicate several things.

You must check to see if the master or slave cylinders are leaking. If they are, you must correct that problem first.
If you just added fluid, then you probably need to also bleed the hydraulic lines to the slave cylinder. This is done exactly like you bleed brakes. If this does not make sense, then you need to go to the mechanic.

Hydraulic clutches only have a limited range of disengagement travel. The rest of the slave cylinder travel is used to make it "self adjusting." Air in the system compresses and reduces the solid travel of the slave cylinder. Air in the system can also cause the throwout bearing to be under constant light pressure and eventually wear it out.

If there are no visible leaks then it can indicate a condition where the clutch and/or clutch engagement mechanism could be completely worn out. Sometimes on the hydraulic slave cylinder there is a mechanical adjustment that can restore the active portion of the clutch travel to the right point to disengage the clutch.

Your goal is to get the clutch slave cylinder to operate solidly without air in the system and to just disengage the throwout bearing from the clutch diaphragm when the pedal is released. When the pedal is pressed, the slave cylinder will engage the throwout bearing against the clutch diaphragm and pull the clutch plate from the transmission side away from the flywheel to release pressure on the clutch disk. If this does not happen, then the clutch disk material is worn to the point that it takes more than the regular amount of travel to disengage.

I would not jump to the conclusion that the clutch disk is rusted to the clutch plates especially if you have had to fill the hydraulic clutch reservoir. If you can get enough access to squirt solvent into the clutch area, you might be able to see the clutch disk material. You can measure if the disk is worn out by the distance between the flywheel and clutch plate in the engaged position.


....


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stuck clutch on Agco Allis tractor

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sprty77
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1 granbury texas
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2004-06-09          88154


IT IS A BROKEN PRESSURE PLATE RELEASE ARM OR RELEASE ARM PIVOT PIN
i have seen it many times on old massey fergusons,fords,
internationals, on and on
the pivot pin that attaches the lever arm (part of the pressure plate) to the pressure plate housing has broke or fallen out, SOME HAVE BOLTS, THESE SHOULD BE TACK WELDED
ON ASSEMBLY TO PREVENT FALLING OUT.
when you push the clutch in , the throw out bearing pushes aginst these arms, if one arm pin or even the are itself is
broken the clutch will only release for 2/3'rds of the diameter, the other third is still touching the flywheel.
i knew a guy that started his tractor in gear for 10 years
till he finally let me help him replace the pressure plate and clutch.
mike in
texas ....


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