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vince nagy
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1999-09-20          8145


I've never owned more than a standard lot before! I now have about 5 mostly flat finished meadow-like acres that I'm going to have to maintain (hopefully mulch), about 600' of gravel and grass driveway to keep clear in winter, and a few projects in mind. The projects include putting in some trees, maybe a formal garden, pagoda, pond... we'd like to turn an acre or two into a little park. I have to keep reminding myself that the immediate requirement is just to keep the finished part finished and the drive cleared. The rest is likely to happen, but a little at a time, and over the next few years. OK, I'm a dreamer...First, I was planning on getting a Toro 522xi. After all, it can have a loader, dozer blade, snow blower, and drag a plow. But am starting to believe the projects might be too much for a tractor that size. The ground is pretty packed and rocky, and it might take some real work to get it to support a respectable garden. I'd rather get something that I won't be afraid I'll break. Is this a valid concern?Then I was thinking about getting the Steiner 430. Its drawbacks are I haven't ever really heard about the company, and it seems I'd be locked into their implement set. It still won't handle a back hoe either, and one might make the garden and other project that much easier. It also seems expensive for what it can do, but I'm not sure how to judge that.Now I've been offered a 97 NH 1725 4wd diesel with only 30 hours. I'm still waiting on the price (any help on what would a good price would be?). I've seen some pro and con posts about this tractor(just found this site this morning!). I'm thinking that with something like this, I might be able to rent some attachments (like a posthole digger) if I need one for a specific project, so I might not need to buy everything, and I won't be afraid of breaking it. And, given that I maintain it, I think the bigger machines should hold their value better than the smaller ones. But, I'm worried that it might be overkill for the mowing, and that the attachments (like a snow blower) will all cost a mint.So, ladies and gents, can anyone help?Thanks for your time and advice,Vince



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Couldn t get a newer newbie tractor sizing questions

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Keith
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1999-09-20          8147


Vince, you've come to the right place for opinions!! We just love spending other folks money too! I think the first you need to ask yourself is do you have lots of spare time to spend on working your 5 acres, or do you want to be able to get the work done and then do some other things too? It sounds like you have big plans for it and that's great but the right equipment will get work done the most efficiently. The bigger garden tractors like the TORO can do almost the same work as compact diesel, it only takes them a while longer to do it. Likewise, a compact diesel can do almost the same work as a larger (say 36-50hp) tractor, but it takes them a bit longer too. Just keep in mind that what makes a tractor work effectively is power and weight! The more you have of both of those, the bigger you can increase the size of the implements to work faster. One drawback to using a smaller tractor is that you can overload/overwork if it is not heavy/powerful enough to do the job. The big advantage is price, but it may stay broke more if you overwork it. Some disadvantages to buying a larger compact tractor are price (of implements too), manuveurability, it's heavier, and a lot more trouble to move (compared to a garden tractor) around if needed to. The big advantage to getting a compact is that it opens you up to a huge array of implements and options such as backhoes, etc.. I would stay away from tractors that use non-standard 3pt implements. That limits availablity of those implements in the new and used market, and it limits your market if you decide to resale. For your immediate needs of maintaining the meadows/fields and driveway I would definitely go with a compact diesel tractor of about 20-24hp. A tractor this size with a loader will do a heck of a lot of work and run any 3pt implement that is sized right for it. Doesn't sound like you really need four wheel drive on a level 5 acres UNLESS you have a heavy snowfall or really muddy/soft/sandy/places. If you decide later on to move up to a larger tractor, the compact will be very easy to resale. Perhaps you can find someone/friend that will let you "borrow" a compact for a few days to see how you like the size of it. This will give you a real good idea of what you need. If nothing else, go rent a Kubota with a 5 foot finish mower and a 5 foot box blade for a day and just get the feel of it, and see what it can do. As you have noted, the cost of implements to go with your tractor can be expensive but that is part of the game. Just keep in mind that a green/orange/blue compact will last almost forever when you maintain it properly, and the same for goes for good implements too. Good luck with your decision and let us know what you end up buying. ....


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Kim Hartshorn
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1999-09-20          8148


I am also new to tractors. We have a 30 acre hilly woodlot that had major ice storm damage and needs a major thinning...but the lumber is not marketable enough for a logger to come in. So I ended up figuring out that it would be cheaper to buy a tractor and do it myself. Besides I really like to tinker.Without knowing much I ended up getting a Ford 1500 4wd with loader, I paid 6500 which I now think was a bit high...but I did get it from a dealer so there was at least a modicum of warranty protection along with it. So far I love it, I have fixed our road which was in terrible shape with a blade I modified from an old steel wheeled grader that was falling apart on the property, I cut a road through a small hogsback and down a slope with the loader that would have cost me at least the price of the tractor to have contracted out. And I have cut a dragged a ton of trees, including the ones I made the bridge out of. In general I have been having loads of fun doing work on a piece of land I used to find intimidating...(actually it was the honey-do list that I found intimidating) and just four short weeks ago I didnt know a 2n from a Kubota. This tractor is rated at 17hp at the PTO, which I understand is the old way of describing a 25hp tractor. So far it has done everything I have asked of it including dragging an 80' poplar (14" at the butt) uphill! It is plenty powerful enough for me...plenty of power to be a little scary...plenty enough power to have me seriously thinking about forking out the three hundred bucks for the ROPS!Have Fun!Kim ....


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Larry
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 0 St.Davids
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1999-09-20          8151


I agree with the message posted by Keith. The only thing that Keith and I have a difference of opinion on is 4wd. Even if your 5 acres are flat solid ground, you should consider 4wd if you are going to use a loader. I have a JD 4100 and the loader is not very effective in 2wd. In heavy use I have used 4wd with differential lock. ....


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RCH
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1999-09-20          8152


I agree--Get 4wheel drive.For snow removel 4 WD beats fooling around with chains which often are impossible because of fender clearence on a small tractor.Even if your land is flat wet spots and mud will waylay you. ....


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PaulB
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1999-09-20          8153


Vince - 1 year ago I didn't know what a compact tractor was, now I have learned enough to offer some advice. I have 10 acres, pretty hilly, and horses. For me, this means lots of lifting, pulling, and snow removal (300 foot gravel driveway). I have not seen the toro to which you refer, so I can not comment. If it is like the heavy duty 2 wheel drive John Deere garden tractors like their 400 series, yes you can mount lots of stuff on them, but they will always suffer from low weight and 2 wheel drive when compared to a compact tractor. The Steiner is a great machine, wish I had one. However, you are stuck with only steiner implements, and only one at a time. I will often use, for example, a front loader and a back blade mounted at the same time. With the steiner this is impossible. Another disadvantage of a steiner compared to a compact tractor is cost of implements. The new post hole digger for the steiner is $2,500 at my dealer. An aftermarket 3-point post hole digger for my tractor is $500 or so. Remember, no matter what compact you buy, they all have universal fit with aftermarket implements from dozens of manufacturers. This means you can pick and choose, rent, borrow if you are lucky, or buy used. My choice was a compact tractor. I bought a Kubota B1700 hydrostatic. I went Kubota because of the apparent quality, a good deal from my dealer, and their 3 year warranty vs. 2 years for most other manufacturers.Only 60 hours on it so far, but so far it has been great, and has done a lot of work I would otherwise have done by hand. They are expensive, but for your needs I think worth it. good luckPaul ....


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Couldn t get a newer newbie tractor sizing questions

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RCH
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1999-09-20          8154


I agree--Get 4wheel drive.For snow removel 4 WD beats fooling around with chains which often are impossible because of fender clearence on a small tractor.Even if your land is flat wet spots and mud will waylay you. A creeper range increases the versatility for snow-blowing and tilling. I`d buy a seperate machine for lawn mowing--a hydrostatic for sure so the kids and wife can handle it.Besides taking a mower off and on is a pain and the weight and ag tires(if that is what you get)is hard on the lawn.Definitely a category 1 3point hitch for the most option on implements.The trick is to buy the right thing the first time.That saves $$. ....


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Couldn t get a newer newbie tractor sizing questions

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Jack
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1999-09-20          8155


For my money I would steer clear of a NH1725. Too many smokin 1725's out there for me. I have heard alot of good things about the new TC series NH Boomers, and would think that would be the way to go if NH is your favorite.Back to the Garden Tractor issue, I have the largest Wheelhorse that they make. Wheelhorse was bought by Toro so the 522i you are talking aboutis probably about the same sizee as mine. I have had my WH for 16 years, Great Machine, Yes it can snow Plow, and yes it can snow blow, yes it can pull a plow.But the reality is, when the snow gets too deep greater, than a couple of inches, or the length pushed gets too long or too wide it just does not cut it anymore. You wide Ramming that little machine into the snow pile to make progress and giving yourself a back ache!You can plow soil with it and I have done more than my share with it, but since you are only doing a row at a time you kinda flatten what you just did with the machine as you go for another row.How about Running implements off the PTO. I have the Front Snow Blower. Great Blower, only clogs with heavy slush conditions. Problem with only two wheel drive and 200 lbs hanging off the front end it loses traction on any type of slope and is very difficult to turn in any direction with all the forward weight.My advice would be to go with a Kubota B2400 or a JD 4200 with the 4WD you wouldn't be sorry. For that Toro they would probably charge you over $5k and then add a loader which would not be very useful. ....


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Roger L.
Join Date: Jun 1999
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1999-09-20          8159


I sure agree with Vince when he says that a compact diesel can almost do all the work that a larger tractor can do....it just takes longer. My compact is 4wd 12 speed 33 Hp, and my Ag tractor is 2wd 6 speed 35 Hp. Both have a modern loader, power steering, Ag tires, and a back blade. Both of them work fine, without any problems at all. The 4wd has the wheels set all the way out. The Ag tractor has the wheels about 75% out. I really enjoy the compact tractor....it is a blast to use. But much as I hate to admit it, I must say that for most work the Ag tractor will outwork the compact by so much that comparisons are silly. For grading, The Ag tractor will do in an hour what the compact takes all afternoon to accomplish....and easily pulls loads that the compact won't budge. For strictly loader work -like moving dirt - they are about the same, the Ag tractor's bucket carries twice as much, but the compact is handier and quicker. For dead lift, the Ag tractor will lift about 50% more, but more importantly it will drive around with that weight in the bucket without feeling unstable on side hills or slopes. Operator comfort on the Ag tractor is superb....on the compact it is an afterthought. Now the Compact is fairly heavy....a little heavier than a JD 4600. It has wheel weights, normal attachments, and new tires. Even so, the traction of the 2wd Ag tractor is much better - on dirt, deep mud, and dry ground. Vince said it: sometimes I want to spend my time working on my small acreage...then I use the compact. Other times I just need to get something done in a hurry so that I can get on to other jobs. Then I use the Ag tractor. It depends on my mood as much as anything. Roger Loving ....


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Craig
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1999-09-21          8162


I have about the same conditions, with brush instead of meadows. I bought a JD4100 with loader (you can only get these with 4wd). It is a great little tractor with lots of power. I have pushed 20" of snow with a backblade, moved plenty of hard and heavy clay, and mow grass with a 5' finishing mower. It will not take a backhoe, if you put an aftermarket one on, it viods your warrenty. Absolultly no complaints! Always power to spare! If you plan on digging a pond, might I suggest that you spend $2,000.00 to rent a big machine, ie. a bid cat excavator, to do the digging rather than a small backhoe that will cost you $5000 + and take forever. But most importantly, The biggest thing is the dealer you get the tractor from. The service from the dealer is much more important than the color of the tractor. All the compacts are built like tanks. My 4100 stalled out at 2:00 on a Saturday and wouldn't start. I called my dealer and he had a mechanic at my house by 3:00 the same day. It was only a wire that came disconnected. Service like that beats the color choice! Have fun and TEST DRIVE! ....


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MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 0
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1999-09-21          8176


Vince,Steiners are excellent machines, but as you said, seem pricy for their abilities, and available/propriatary implements. I think its kind of a specialty machine. Do yourself a favor and buy 4wd, regardless what you choose. I think we all forgot to mention that unlike a car, a 2wd tractor only has 2 wheel braking. This can be potentially dangerous as the tractor size lessens. Think of decending down a hill on wet grass, and the weight of the tractor itself plus the implement starts to push you. Engaged 4WD can somewhat compensate for this pushing effect, Obviously because all four wheels are creating friction against the ground instead of two. Something to think about. ....


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Couldn t get a newer newbie tractor sizing questions

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MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999
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1999-09-21          8177


Vince,Steiners are excellent machines, but as you said, seem pricy for their abilities, and available/propriatary implements. I think its kind of a specialty machine. Do yourself a favor and buy 4wd, regardless what you choose. I think we all forgot to mention that unlike a car, a 2wd tractor only has 2 wheel braking. This can be potentially dangerous as the tractor size lessens. Think of decending down a hill on wet grass, and the weight of the tractor itself plus the implement starts to push you. Engaged 4WD can somewhat compensate for this pushing effect, Obviously because all four wheels are creating friction against the ground instead of two. Something to think about. ....


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